New to sailing, looking for advice and wanting to crew

[SCHodge]

Hello! I started sailing back in early May at Tradewinds in Richmond. Since then, I've been getting out on the water about once a week, and I did my first race last night as ballast at the Berkeley Yacht Club.

Anyway, I'm moving from Berkeley to the Redwood City area in a couple of months for work, and am looking to meet people to sail with and/or crew for in races. (Oh, I'm good for food/drinks)

I was also pondering the idea of buying a boat in the next year or so; I was wondering what people's ideas were on boats that are relatively inexpensive (under $50k good, under $30k better), relatively fast, and can handle a proper marine head and not a portapotty. Oh, and can be sailed short/singlehanded relatively easily. I'm not much on fancy wood interiors, they look rather bleak and clausterphobic to my eyes. I'd rather unadorned fiberglass.

Thanks!

Shayne Hodge
schodge@ieee.org

[BobJ]

Shayne, you might start at this site (http://sbyra.home.comcast.net/~sbyra/) for crewing in the South Bay. It looks like Sequoia Yacht Club in Redwood City has Wednesday night "beer can" races, which might offer opportunities to crew like you did in Berkeley.

You can also post on the various crew lists at sfsailing.com and latitude38.com.

Finally, don't be in a hurry to buy a boat. They are easy to buy, expensive to own and hard to sell, and until you've sailed a bunch you don't really know what to look for.

[jfoster]

Shane:

A couple of hundred feet from the Sequoia Yacht Club (http://www.sequoiayc.org/) in the Port of Redwood City is an ASA sailing school and club, similar in offerings to that of Tradewinds Sailing (http://www.tradewindssailing.com/index.shtml) of Point Richmond. It is the Spinnaker Sailing School (http://www.spinnakersailing.com/).

The Tradewinds and Spinnaker (Redwood City, not to be confused with Spinnaker out of San Francisco) facilities are similar in another aspect: In both cases you leave the dock of the sailing school and have a rather long sail in sheltered water before you make it out into the larger waters of the bay. This is a great confidence and skill builder.

Bob J and I agree, do lots and lots of sailing on a variety of boats before you buy one. Buying is very easy. Selling can be an awful financial reality check.

It is such an awful trap to buy a boat at a fair market price for that type, and then discover that to make it race competitive, to say nothing of safe and comfortable, you end up spending more than the purchase price again, leaving you with an investment you cannot recover.

As for what boat to buy? Ha! Why not ask an easy question such as what person to marry?.....(grin)......

John
Nonsuch 22 (http://www.pbase.com/nonsuch/22_gallery), sail #48, Blueberry

[Eyrie]

If you want to get an idea of what sorts of boats are good for long distance singlehanded sailing, have a look at the TransPac web site: http://www.sfbaysss.org/TransPac/transpac2008/transpac_2008_index.html
There is a link to an excell list of the racers/results from all the races since 1978. You can sort it by boat type to get an idea of what boats are the most popular choice amongst this crowd of weirdos. So far the top 4 choices are: Cal 40, Olson 30, Hawkfarm 28, & Moore 24. You can also browse through the archived pages of previous races to read about the skippers and their boats in order to get a feel for what level of dementia you need to have to choose a particular type of boat. Then you can keep your eyes open for any ride opportunities on these boats and see what you think for yourself.

You can do the same for local singlehanding by going to the SSS web site racing page:
http://www.sfbaysss.org/racing-new.html
and have a look at what are the most popular types of boats entered.

After August and the 30th anniversary TransPac is completed I'd be happy to give you a ride on a Hawkfarm 28, the poster child of unadorned fiberglass.

Synthia/Eyrie

[SCHodge]

Thanks for the advice. I'll definitely get on everything I can find that floats before I buy anything.

BTW, where's the best source for sailing clothes (foul-weather gear, or something slightly less extreme than that)? I discovered high wind + jeans + job as rail meat = soaked.

Shayne

[BobJ]

Foul weather gear is the right term, even though it sounds a little extreme. Aka "foulies" or "wet gear." You can spend $300-$400 on a decent set for inshore. I used West Marine's middle grade, non-breathable type for a long time.

If you get invited to do an ocean race, you'll want to upgrade to the breathable (GoreTex) type. Top-of-the-line brands are Musto or Henry Lloyd, and a good set will cost $800-$1,100. If you graduate to foredeck you'll also need a pair of boots.

[Ergo]

Hi Shayne,

I agree with Bob. Foulies are a bit expensive but worth every cent. Being wet and cold becomes a big safety issue when feeling wet and cold turns into becoming hypothermic.

Bill Merrick

[blighbaum]

Under your fowlies, you should wear ski clothes. Polartec, Caplene (spelling?), etc. Wool is okay. No jeans or other cotton. I had to learn this the hard way!

-- Tom Kirschbaum, Feral

[AlanH]

If you have your own foul weather gear, gloves, inflatable lifejacket w/harness and strobe and you know clockwise from counterclockwise and don't throw up...or know what drugs to take to keep from throwing up.....you can pretty much find rides all over the place on the Bay and the Gulf of the Farallones.

Oh, a positive attitude helps, as does not being a tiller hog, and remembering who pays the boat bills.

Intermediate -level foul weather gear $350 a set
gloves... $20 a pair
polypro undies, tops and bottoms.... $40
boat shoes.... $60
inflatable lifejacket with harness.... $150
safety tether to attach to harness..... $50

total investment (not including sexy sunglasses and tote bag and hat inscribed with favorite sailmakers logo) about $675 and you're set for a couple of years.

[SCHodge]

Thanks for all the feedback. A couple of thoughts:

1) Synthetic fabrics directly on my skin don't agree very well with me, and I've never skied so references to skiing clothes are meeting with a lack of comprehension. FWIW, so long as I'm dry, I tolerate and frankly prefer cool to cold. While dry :)

2) Boating shoes - I need to get some in a size 13 to 15, which is a real pain - again, suggestions on source?

3) Is the Farralones considered an ocean race, or does that term refer to longer races than that?

4) Any suggestions on transitioning from cruising skills to racing skills? I've found one school around here (J/World?) that offers racing classes, every place else seems more slanted toward teaching cruising someplace warm.

Thanks again for all the advice!

Shayne

[jfoster]

Thanks for all the feedback. A couple of thoughts:

SNIP
2) Boating shoes - I need to get some in a size 13 to 15, which is a real pain - again, suggestions on source?

SNIP
Shayne

The requirement for boating shoes is to have some bottom surface that will not slip on a wet deck. Although a lot of high end boat shoes claim to have magical treads, the way tires claim to have all weather tread patterns, at the end of the day it is the material itself that counts.

You might put on your most comfortable sport shoes ( running, tennis, even hiking shoes and experiment on a deck that you have wet down with a hose or a bucket of water. Once you have established a pair of shoes you trust in their grip on a wet deck you then have the second aspect of boat shoes to consider. While testing your shoes, make sure they do not leave black scuff marks.

Rail meat mans your legs are exposed to repeated washings of salt water. After a few hours your feet are considerably the worse for wear in terms of constant moisture and the heat loss though that moisture. You might be tempted to wear boots, but there you might end up with your feet bathed in their own sweat, with again the heat transmission problem, unless you opt for expensive, high end, breathable boots.

Ahhh but there is an inexpensive solution. Go to the nearest REI store, in the SF bay area, this is the Gilman street exit off 580. wear the previously mentioned "trusted" shoes. Find their Sealskinz (http://www.sealskinz.com/) water proof socks. Try on a pair and buy a couple of pairs. Do not be put off by their Gumby looking appearance or their seeming to be too small before you put them on. They stretch quite nicely without binding your toes. If REI does not have a size to fit your pontoons, try the link to the Sealskinz company.

The Sealskinz waterproof socks allow your shoes to be sopping wet, but keep your feet warm and dry. These socks are a rail meat favorite.

A word of caution. The Sealskinz socks are a triple layer sock. Do NOT, EVER, wring them out. That will rip the middle layer and render them useless.

I have used them for years under boat sandals. (My sandals have a curled up front edge for toe protection and good velcro straps to keep them on). Your mileage may vary.

John
Blueberry, Nonsuch 22 sail #48

[Critter]

1) Synthetic fabrics directly on my skin don't agree very well with me, and I've never skied so references to skiing clothes are meeting with a lack of comprehension.

I hear you. I've just tried, a couple of times when staying in the snow, strapping on a pair of somebody else's old skis with cable bindings and sliding around outside until I got frustrated. As for clothing, I get all my inside layers for sailing from campmor.com - discounted prices, seconds etc. They sell silk underwear with great claims for its performance. I haven't tried it, but if you have a problem with synthetics it might be worth a try.



3) Is the Farralones considered an ocean race, or does that term refer to longer races than that?

I'd call it an ocean race, sure.



4) Any suggestions on transitioning from cruising skills to racing skills? I've found one school around here (J/World?) that offers racing classes, every place else seems more slanted toward teaching cruising someplace warm.

If you can afford classes, J/World is probably a good choice. At Club Nautique where I teach, we usually run a racing clinic once a year, but you're right that CN and the rest of them are strongly cruising oriented. Best thing is probably to get on a crew list; skippers are always looking for crew. Like me! PM me and I'll get you out there - Friday nights and a few other races.

[SCHodge]

OK, so I now have foulies, super light silk underlayers, new shoes (a water shoe / sandal hybrid) and need to return the water proof socks I got for the model that doesn't go up as high on my leg. Credit card is *screaming*.

Leaving me with two questions:

1) What do I wear as a middle layer? The silk seems to run just looking it, and the zipper on the coat will kill it in short order.
2) How do I accomplish (1) w/o getting hotter? My goal is dry, not warm - I rather like cold, and the foulies alone are super warm to my thermometer.

Once again, thanks for all the advice.

Shayne

[AlanH]

OK, so I now have foulies, super light silk underlayers, new shoes (a water shoe / sandal hybrid) and need to return the water proof socks I got for the model that doesn't go up as high on my leg. Credit card is *screaming*.

Leaving me with two questions:

1) What do I wear as a middle layer? The silk seems to run just looking it, and the zipper on the coat will kill it in short order.
2) How do I accomplish (1) w/o getting hotter? My goal is dry, not warm - I rather like cold, and the foulies alone are super warm to my thermometer.

Once again, thanks for all the advice.

Shayne

My two cents is to put the stuff on, quit stressing over the kind of long underwear you have, and go sailing. If it's too hot, then take it off. Whatever.

Go sailing.

[Wylieguy]

Shayne, I agree with Alan. Go sailing! You'll quickly find out what works and what doesn't. A chilly/sweaty/wet afternoon or evening on SF Bay is survivable. My 2¢ worth about foulies is this: How committed are you to sail boating are you? If you're wavering, go inexpensive (and short-lived). If you think you're going to stick, buy the best you can -- now! Breathable foulies (I like salopettes(sp?) instead of pants since I can wear them with light jacket over), expensive boots (I'm a "boot guy" & I LOVE my Dubarrys - should have broken down and paid the price decades ago!), best lifejacket (built in harness if you think any offshore sailing's in the future, etc. It's not a fashion show, so buy foulies you can layer up underneath. Yellow is easier to see in the water, especially in darkness - just in case. But, stop "outfitting" yourself and get out there. Pat Broderick