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talonf4u
02-13-2021, 08:41 PM
My main issue with racing this year is time. I don't have the time to sail it home. Anyone coordinating for shipping deals yet this year? That's going to be the make or break for me.

brianb
02-14-2021, 08:54 AM
Check with Matson on their shipping schedule and rates for SHTP racers. Also, be aware the ship volume traveling to Hawaii has reduced due to the lower need for goods on the island. This could delay shipments in both directions.

Regards,
Brian

Philpott
02-14-2021, 09:26 AM
Also, be aware the ship volume traveling to Hawaii has reduced due to the lower need for goods on the island. This could delay shipments in both directions.
Regards, Brian

Not to worry. As long as there is rum for the mai tais we’re ready in Hanalei Bay. I’ve had these paper umbrellas since 2019.

6257

solosailor
02-14-2021, 10:46 AM
Others will need to chime in here but is the barge from Kauai going to be available with the crane? If so how much does the crane handle weight wise because a SF3200 weighs a lot more than an Olson 30.

Also, lead is for keels, not umbrellas in your drinks !

solosailor
02-14-2021, 12:35 PM
I see the SF3200 comes in at 7500 lbs base. Do you have a trailer? If the barge is an option if the crane is capable. If you have a cradle then you would need to sail it to Oahu to travel lift out. You'll also need to hire someone with a large enough truck to move it from the yard to Matson. My all up load (boat/trailer/gear) came in about 6500 lbs so I was able to just rent a pickup from Enterprise to move it.

jamesmcn
02-14-2021, 02:30 PM
Others will need to chime in here but is the barge from Kauai going to be available with the crane? If so how much does the crane handle weight wise because a SF3200 weighs a lot more than an Olson 30.

Also, lead is for keels, not umbrellas in your drinks !

How else are us low-carb folks supposed to sweeten our drinks?

talonf4u
02-15-2021, 09:11 AM
Yeah, she's heavy compared to all these little downwind boats... I don't have a trailer but the boat fits about right on a J/105 trailer so it isn't impossible to borrow or rent one. I was assuming I'd need to sail it to Honolulu but you guys are implying that if the crane can handle the load, I could barge it back from Kauai, eh?

brianb
02-15-2021, 12:44 PM
The barge is making trips, but the frequency is down. The Crane lifted a Catalina 34 a few years back onto a trailer. I believe they weigh in at about 11,000 lbs. There is an issue with weight and keel depth. The deeper the keel, the further your boat will be from the dock. The further the crane boom has to reach. At some point the crane ends up in the water with the boom laying in the boats deck. In order to get an understanding of what is possible I would suggest contacting Larry Conklin, the crane owner/operator and all around expert on getting this done. Biz is Island Crane, he has an email contact. Private message me and I will send his phone number.

brianb
02-15-2021, 12:52 PM
talon4u - I sent you a PM.
Brian

DaveH
02-15-2021, 01:16 PM
The barge is making trips, but the frequency is down. The Crane lifted a Catalina 34 a few years back onto a trailer. I believe they weigh in at about 11,000 lbs. There is an issue with weight and keel depth. The deeper the keel, the further your boat will be from the dock. The further the crane boom has to reach. At some point the crane ends up in the water with the boom laying in the boats deck. In order to get an understanding of what is possible I would suggest contacting Larry Conklin, the crane owner/operator and all around expert on getting this done. Biz is Island Crane, he has an email contact. Private message me and I will send his phone number.

This is mostly, but not exactly, accurate. Specific to Margie's former boat (the Catalina 34) it was craned out in Kauai and barged to Honolulu, but not by Larry's crane.
That lift required a different larger crane, special for that lift. The fact that Matson let it roll down the ramp while loading it in Honolulu is not directly pertinent, but it happened.

Definitely want to talk to Larry, but it sounds to me like the combination of keel depth (meaning the crane arm needs to extend out farther from the shore and thus increasing the "tipping force") and weight will put you on the bubble.
In recent years, Larry's working number with his rig is in the neighborhood of 6900 lbs; that will vary with how deep the water is on the quay and how far he'll need to extend his rigs jib boom.

JimQuanci
02-24-2021, 04:11 PM
Do cold beers come with those cute umbrella's? Counting the days...

seawisdom
03-15-2021, 10:31 PM
For those of us who are looking to ship home via a delivery crew (unfortunately I don't have the time to sail back from Kauai, and I can't ship the boat back either because of her size), I need to get a surveyor to do an inspection in order to underwrite insurance coverage for the trip back for my delivery crew. I spoke with Larry tonight after the Zoom call. He is checking for surveyor for me. Larry is also asking to see if there is anyone else looking to hire a surveyor in Kauai. Please let me know. Thanks.
-Will, SEA WISDOM

WBChristie
03-16-2021, 07:48 AM
Hi Will....wouldn't that be easier to get done in SFO.... or is that an insurance stipulation that it be done in Kauai?

BobJ
03-16-2021, 12:13 PM
I know a great surveyor in the North Bay, FWIW.

DaveH
03-16-2021, 02:24 PM
Going from foggy memory here, but I believe it needs to be done in Kauai because of the break in coverage that is usually involved, plus whoever is writing the rider will want to know the current condition of the boat, not the condition before an ocean passage.
Again, that's just my memory. I imagine the best thing is to clarify with whoever is actually asking for the survey.

DH

seawisdom
03-16-2021, 04:01 PM
That's right, the survey has to be done in Kauai after the race and before the delivery crew sailing back to SF. It makes the logistics challenging because it takes time to do the survey and then writing up the survey. Then the insurance company has to underwrite it.

seawisdom
03-18-2021, 01:21 PM
The latest development is that in 2021, no carrier would underwrite coverage for a crewed delivery after a singlehanded race. In 2020, they would do it, but not in 2021!!! I assume Sea Wisdom's 42 ft LOA is too big to get shipped back with the rest of the fleet. Please correct me if I'm wrong. Is there another way to get the boat back besides sailing back solo? Thanks for everyone's insight.

solosailor
03-19-2021, 03:17 PM
Is there another way to get the boat back besides sailing back solo?Break out another 10+ boats bucks.

DaveH
03-20-2021, 09:16 AM
All -
I heard back from Matson and here is what I know as of right now 03/19/2021

Rates -
$80/measured Ton; 1 measured ton= 40 Cubic Feet
The Cubic tonnage Measurement consists of:

the total length of the boat, plus any extra trailer length (eg tongue or tail past the bow or stern) x
the total height of the boat sitting on the trailer (if the mast / spreaders are on top, it counts, as do lifelines) x
the max width of the boat (or trailer, whichever is greater)

the length of the mast does not count in this measurement

quick math for a 30' boat - (30'Lx11'Wx12'H=3960 cubic feet)/40 = 99 measured tons - 99*$80 = $7920
**this is just quick math and the published rates; experience has shown that there will likely be surcharges and other costs that will add to the base price.

Size Limits

Width - NTE 12'W
Height- NTE 14'T (measured from the ground)
Length- NTE 80'L



When do you need to ship the trailer?
They don't have a precise sailing schedule yet past May, but with one boat in lay-up things are definitely going to take longer than past years.
official word is to plan on a 3-4 week transit time for your trailer to Kauai form OAK.
That means that for Larry to have enough time to collect it and resolve any issues, you need to plan to ship your trailer NLT the first week of June
The trailer ships free Eastbound

Misc Reminders
as noted elsewhere, you're empty trailer will have to pass Agricultural inspection in Kauai; unlocked, empty and clean trailer boxes and take the time to hose off any cobwebs or other detritus that's accumulated around the axles/undercarriage.
GET IN TOUCH WITH LARRY CONKLIN ASAP - (808)639-1021; islcr3@gmail.com

DH

AZ Sailor
03-23-2021, 09:47 AM
If you are thinking of selling the boat rather than shipping or sailing it back, please let me know. A friend of mine here in Hilo is looking for an ocean-worthy sail boat. PM me here or send email to me at lee [dot] johnson [at] q [dot] com.

Philpott
03-23-2021, 09:54 AM
If you are thinking of selling the boat rather than shipping or sailing it back, please let me know. A friend of mine here in Hilo is looking for an ocean-worthy sail boat. PM me here or send email to me at lee [dot] johnson [at] q [dot] com.

Will's boat? Whoa! Now THAT'S a boat to buy! I can't imagine a prettier or better prepared yacht (sorry, Bob, but it IS a Hinckley). It's just a wee bit too big for me, otherwise I would be interested myself. What do you say, Will? That would avoid the whole delivery issue.

BobJ
03-23-2021, 10:20 AM
I took Lee's inquiry to be more general to the fleet.

Some boats should not be sold. Hinckleys often stay in the family and get handed down.

Will should have no trouble finding a delivery crew. Just don't let them eat all the profiteroles.

AZ Sailor
03-23-2021, 11:59 AM
I took Lee's inquiry to be more general to the fleet.

. . .

Yep, this just seemed to be the section of the forum where the post would draw attention of prospective sellers in the fleet.

seawisdom
03-23-2021, 05:17 PM
Thanks everyone for trying to help me out. But Sea Wisdom is not for sale in Kauai. :) Bob is right, I intend to keep her for as long as I can. I have secured an excellent delivery captain to bring her back. However, it is the insurance in 2021 that is creating a roadblock. The new rule for 2021 is that a carrier would not underwrite a policy to sail the boat across the ocean after a singlehanded race. Without insurance, unfortunately I can't hire anyone to sail her back. I just spoke with Larry Conklin today. He was kind enough to look for a surveyor for me in HI. He is also baffled by the insurance roadblock. The SER for SHTP is far more stringent than a typical cruising boat.

I didn't have this problem in 2020. If anyone knows any insurance company that would underwrite this, please let me know. This is becoming the most difficult part of the race planning, sigh...

However, I am not ruling out of bringing back Sea Wisdom by myself along with the rest of fleet. Seems like it will be a good turnout for the return trip.

JimQuanci
03-24-2021, 07:29 PM
Had that insurance problem in 2012... no insurance to get to Hawaii singlehanded... and required a survey in Hawaii to get insurance for the delivery home... which turned out to be way too complex (fly a surveyor from Oahu... maybe maybe not with a written survey (a few days after the survey) one "might get lucky and get the insurance company to give the insurance... one week on Hanalei is just not long enough to pull this off... so no insurance either direction in 2012... and same deal for 2018 PacCup where insurance starting asking lots of additional questions two weeks before the start and couldn't get their act together before the start. So another race with no insurance both ways. Which is going to happen again this year. Now the 2022 PacCup I have a bit of a chance to get insurance both ways... I am starting the conversation with my insurance company early... like right now as I renew it for the coming year (its getting the offshore "rider" that is the challenge). Now my boat is not worth much... if she goes down at sea, c'est la vie... like a warrior dying in battle. Its the people on board that insurance is for...

seawisdom
03-25-2021, 07:55 AM
Agreed with you, Jim. I'm getting the insurance for the crew on board. For the years that you didn't have insurance for the crew, did you all have to sign a mutual "hold harmless" agreement?

seawisdom
03-27-2021, 10:47 AM
I got the impression from Larry that most boats will end up at Nawiliwili. This is for boats that are being shipped back (for obvious reasons) and also for boats that are preparing to sail back because according to Larry, it's just much easier to provision and refuel the boats from Nawiliwili. I am just curious from the past SHTP participants who sailed back, how much time was your boat spent in Hanalei Bay vs Nawiliwili? I would think refueling a 100G+ tank is quite a bit of work from the beach. Thanks!

AZ Sailor
03-27-2021, 09:24 PM
. . . how much time was your boat spent in Hanalei Bay vs Nawiliwili? I would think refueling a 100G+ tank is quite a bit of work from the beach. Thanks!

After the 2018 race I spent 5 days in each. Some boats from our fleet sailed back straight from Hanalei, but I think most visited Nawiliwili for re-provisioning and fuel, and in my case to await parts being shipped for needed repairs.

Fuel will be enough work from Nawiliwili, but not nearly as bad as doing it off the beach. There was no fuel dock then and no reason to think there's one now, so jerry jugs to the gas station is the usual drill. Still, a lot easier to carry them down the dock than down the beach etc. For your amount of fuel you might ask the crews on the charter fishing boats in the harbor about getting in touch with a local fuel supplier -- someone with a big tank in the bed of a truck and a dispenser pump with a hose that reaches down the dock to the boats.

JimQuanci
03-28-2021, 03:07 PM
Going with no insurance... liability waiver (hold harmless) is not enforceable... maritime law is quite special... Jones Act... keep in mind you are not in the US for most of the voyage so its not US law... so if you are not on the boat (and if you are on the boat, only with friends you really really trust...) yes you need insurance... so best bet is sail to Oahu for the survey and get your insurance for the trip home... spend a week at Keehi Marine for your survey and getting sorted and have a few drinks at Mariana - the bar you can see on Magnum PI which is just a hole in the fence from Keehi Marine. Now the sail to Oahu is another story for another day (it can be rough).

Now back to Fuel...
I buy four 5 gal jenny jugs at the Princeville Ace hardware... and each morning - starting with a large coffee at 8am - fill them at the Princeville gas station and carry them to the boat (car/dinghy or blowup kayak) pouring into two 50 fuel bladders and 33 gallon main tank. By Friday all tanks full (I leave with 110 gal so I have "choices" on the way home... sail over a high, motor thru a high or two, motor last 100 miles (4 of the last six trips home was no wind the last 50-100 miles). One might get lucky and find a friendly cruiser anchored in Hanalei with a nice dinghy with outboard making this easier ($20 per rountrip with a latte for his wife 8am every morning worked for me in 2012... Eric and Emmy who have their boat at RYC at the moment who were in Hanalei on the way back to SF from a south pacific cruise).

dolfinbill
03-30-2021, 06:53 PM
I am just curious from the past SHTP participants who sailed back, how much time was your boat spent in Hanalei Bay vs Nawiliwili?

I did the same routine the last two races. Spend five or six days in Hanalei sharing serious tree time and the yellow house with the other finishers and your new best friends, then off to Nawiliwili for maybe a week to provision, plus being next to the Nawiliwili YC for the awards ceremony and dinner. Not sure where the awards will be held this year but Nawiliwili is the best place to be for provisioning, and an interesting place to visit but not a big fan of the non-floating concrete docks.

Bill Meanley
Dolfin, Crealock 37

Lanikai
03-31-2021, 12:34 AM
you are not in the US for most of the voyage so its not US law... so if you are not on the boat (and if you are on the boat, only with friends you really really trust...) yes you need insurance...

Total noob question: what does an offshore policy cover that's different from a typical inshore/coastal policy, besides range? Sounds like maybe coverage for an "international incident", for example, colliding with a foreign flagged boat outside of territorial waters?

JimQuanci
04-04-2021, 12:00 PM
Its more about what an offshore rider doesnt cover... likely not running rigging... not sails... likely not the mast...

Check what your current insurance says about how far offshore you are covered... most say 20 miles (where getting a tow home is more possible).