Shtp 2012

[Astolfo]

I would love to do the shtp in 2012 and would like to start getting some budget numbers, where to get the qualifiers race schedule, and answers to the regular questions a first SHTP has. I am in Seattle and although I would love to sail it to SF and back from HI I can’t afford the time away from my job so I would have to get the boat shipped to SF and from HI back to Seattle.
Thanks
Astolfo

[cafemontaigne]

Astolfo,

I'm in Seattle too and just did the race. Maybe we can get together sometime and I can answer your questions. I'll send you a PM with my contact info.

Adrian

[ronnie simpson]

Good luck in putting together a campaign for 2012. As you probably know, Adrian won the race this year, so if he's offering you advice.... take it. He had a really successful qualifier, race and delivery home, and he did it on a serious budget.

See you in 2012.

And Adrian, it will most definitely be on in 2012...

[Astolfo]

this is AWESOME!. thanks Adrian, lets talk. looking forward to learn from you.
Astolfo

[Lucie Mewes]

Al Hughes (Dogbark) is also in Seattle and a transpac vet with lots of trophies.

[JakeinDenver]

In the recent Lat 38 article Adrian mentioned he wishes he'd gone after sponsorships like Adam and Ronnie.

I'm wondering if you guys or any other who gained support, wouldn't mind discussing how you approached your sponsors and how much of your budget/equipment you were able to obtain?

As I start looking at my shopping list, it's pretty overwhelming.

Thanks,

Jake

[Critter]

Any of this year's racers want to share actual numbers for expenses?

I suspect I did it cheaper than most. I've been adding up figures and I'm at about $8k. It might get closer to 9 if I could find a missing credit card statement.

That total doesn't include several weeks of lost income, since I had nowhere near enough vacation time saved up to cover the 7 or 8 weeks that I was off work.

Max

[ronnie simpson]

My situation, as well as Adam and AJ's, was a bit unique.

I was approached by a very generous individual who works with a wounded veteran non-profit on a volunteer basis. This individual agreed to loan me his boat for the race, with basically no strings attached. The non-profit had a program that grants a "Warrior's Wish" to wounded veterans. I qualified for the Wish, so I said my wish was to race the SHTP, and as such, I asked for them to pay my entry fee and buy a SSB, auto tuner and radio modem. This came to 5 grand in total. So truth be told, I wasn't really "sponsored" by the non-profit. I was granted some funding which was actually available to any wounded veteran who qualified.

On top of that, I had a boat yard pull the boat off the trailer, give us a few days of yard time, and then splash us for free. The marina gave me a free slip, I got 1 gallon of free bottom paint, free foul weather gear and PFD, and some free halyards. I got some free video cameras, discounts on batteries, discounts on this, discounts on that. Pretty much everyone that sponsored me was either just super nice and wanted to support me (a wounded veteran) and what I was doing (raising money and awareness for a wounded veteran non-profit). I approached every sponsor individually, generally with a packet containing pictures and information about what I was doing. Some people never replied, while some said "sure, what do you want?" and some said "we'll sell to you at cost.". Getting stuff at cost can be a good deal, often times 75% off of retail. If this can cover the additional $900 or so in entry fee (for being sponsored) then it's a good deal. It costs a sponsor nothing to sell to you at cost. Free exposure for them, so it' s a win-win.

I am working on some big time sponsorship for 2012, but it will be completely different and will again be a situation that is rather unique.

Having said all of this, I would not advise you to rely heavily on sponsorship. The race does not have much of a media presence, and a sell for big sponsorship will be difficult.

All in all, I would say Warrior's Wish spent 10-15k on the race, and that doesn't include any new sails. The boat was already more or less entirely equipped, just requiring some parts being replaced, boat repairs, maintenance, etc. It's definitely not a cheap endeavour and I will bet that most competitors went over their budget for what they originally thought it would cost. I know I did. It wiped me out this year and i'm still getting back on my feet financially.

But it was most definitely worth it.

Good luck on your campaign in 2012.

[BobJ]

I'm a CPA in my other life, dealing mostly with businesses (vs. individuals).

Clients are looking for a measurable return on their advertising dollars, including sponsorships. As Ronnie said, his situation was the exception. AJ's was also unusual, being based more on personal relationships. Each of the three guys (Adam, AJ and Ronnie) is a "Mr. Personality" and could sell ice to eskimos.

You'll need to work hard to promote your sponsor's business and given the SHTP's limited exposure (for that matter, sailing's limited exposure), it's a hard sell showing how you will do that.

Local marine businesses who already benefit from our boat prep dollars are the most likely candidates. We had several who sponsored the race this time and last. Even getting that sponsorship (for the organization vs. an individual racer) wasn't easy. (Thanks Rob, Ruben and Bill!)

I would plan on funding your own race and if you pick up some discounts along the way, that's great. If those discounts require advertising on your hull or sails, you will probably have to pay the higher entry fee as a sponsored entry.

[Ergo]

Interesting question. As part of the club's and race's culture, commercial sponsorships haven't been aggressively sought and if the SHTP stays true to its past profile, sponsorship won't be a common feature of future races.

I've raised money for non-profit organizations for almost the past 40 years and helped raise sponsorship funding for a US-based Whitbread syndicate in the late 80's. I know a lot more about raising money than sailing (yes, Phil, Rob, Dan, Bob, Al, Greg, Adam, Mark, Ken, Steve, Jeanne, Jim, Synthia, etc. I know that isn't really saying much). The trade off for sponsorship money comes in the form of sponsor expectations/demands/control and this changes the event. It could change an amatur sailboat race into a marketing campaign in which money trumps skill. SSS will probably never go down that road but in this era of reality TV, it could be a temptation.

I hope the SHTP remains the "race for the rest of us" for a long time.

Regarding budget, my advice is to sit down and figure out the most it could possibly cost then double it. Then sit down and figure out how long it will take to get the work done then triple it and in the frenzy of rebuilding your percfectly good already boat leave a bit of time to learn how to use all the new gear before the race starts. Oddly enough this formula worked even the second time I did the race except for the learning part. I didn't get that right either time.

Best of luck.

Bill Merrick

[JakeinDenver]

I totally agree with Bill's take on the cultural change should sponsorship grow. Furthermore, I really appreciate Ronnie's openess about his entry. "Carpe Diem" is definately an understatement in regards to Ronnie!

What I meant in regards to "sponsorship" was the ability to buy at cost or deep discount. I recognize the low profile of the SHTP would make it very difficult to garner an out and out commercial sponsorship. The ability to gain free product would be great but probably the exception to most competitors experience.

I've been looking for somekind of part-time work to get into an employee discount program but I'm finding Denver is pretty shallow in boating venues and none seem to be hiring. I think I might need to reapproach some of these guys with an invitation to help me by selling at cost and see what they say.... I guess they can only say no.

Thanks for this discussion and your feedback. I see many challenges in making a go at 2012 with outfitting a small 40yr old boat from scratch reasonably is my first big rock. Next on the docket is layout, prioritization, not to mention west coast blue water experience. 22 months already... feels like the race has already begun.

Off to a NEW (and only) dedicated sailing shop in Denver today... wish me luck.

jake

[JakeinDenver]

I figure while I'm at it, I'll just go ahead and ask...

I've connected with Jeff Lebesch but he's pretty tied up until November so I'm reaching out to find any other SHTP vets willing to connect offline to learn more about me and my 26' floating brick :), to offer some experienced advice on making the most of my time and resources.

Hopefully this kind of request isn't taboo.

Thanks!

jake
720.220.7035
jakesuesam at yahoo dot com

[BobJ]

This is the best place Jake and it's definitely not "taboo." Others probably have the same questions you do.

I've been getting some inquiries about SHTP 2012 on the SHTP e-mail but since my tour of duty is over, I'm suggesting they post here.


@AJ and Paul: To quote a famous Canadian singlehander/circumnavigator whose boat name is Haulass (or similar):

"You guys are choking me up, eh."

[AlanH]

In 1996 when I tagged along but didn't do the race, the SSB wasn't a requirement. You could have either an SSB OR a 406 epirb. That year, I bought no new sails, went with an engine I couldn't run for more than fifteen minutes without overheating, and had new standing rigging put on my Ranger 29. I didn't have an autopilot, but I had a Navik windvane. I maxxed out a credit card at $10K.

With Ankle Biter in 2008 I went *extremely* cheap and spent about $8K but I had a lot of gear left over from my Santana 3030, including one autotiller and the SSB and the EPIRB and another Navik. I didn't really much use the nifty new spinnaker I bought from Synthia and in retrospect I wish I'd gotten two 110% headsails stitched together instead. Not that Synthias chute wasn't nice, I just didn't happen to use it that much. That would have brought it down to $6500.

If you add in the flights, the house that Joan and I stayed in, the meals over there, etc. etc it would be at least another $2500 more.

[haulback]

How much have I spent over 3 races?? I'd really prefer not to think about it.....and I was sponsored for the first one in '02 to the tune of $30K....

The one thing I can tell you, is that by the time you are counting fly specks on the ceiling for the last 5 minutes before you die.....the money you spend sailing to Hawaii in the SHTP one summer will be of little consequence.

Jim/Haulback

[Critter]

After reading Alan's post, I thought I'd fill in some of the background for my low expenses.

- No new sails. I bought three used sails (2 spinnakers and a staysail), and Rui at Rooster Sails rehabbed my main and #3. Actually the only time I used the #3 was between the start and Pt. Bonita.

- I borrowed an SSB (thanks Scott!) and Monitor vane (thanks Phil!). For the SSB I worked up a rope-covered antenna at negligible expense.

- Nobody flew out to Hawaii to meet me, and I stayed on the boat in Hanalei.

- I took shameless advantage of Jim Kellam's offer to provide taxi service, including a trip to the ER in Kapa'a when my gashed foot wasn't healing satisfactorily. Thanks Jim, I owe you.

Max

[JakeinDenver]

Anyone know how to get in touch with the makers of the C.A.R.D.? I found their number in Virginia but no answer and their website are static pages that describe the product but no links to buy it. Who sells these things?

Thanks,

jake

[BobJ]

If you really want a C.A.R.D. you can buy mine - I took it off the boat about a year ago. It works but I found it to be pretty ineffective.

[jfoster]

Anyone know how to get in touch with the makers of the C.A.R.D.? I found their number in Virginia but no answer and their website are static pages that describe the product but no links to buy it. Who sells these things?


Hopefully, nobody sell them any more. They were a good idea back in the day. With continuous transmitting low power broadband radar signals being put out by the more modern radars.... not likely to work....

Come to think of it do active responders like SeeMe work when your vessel is swept with broadband radar? http://www.sea-me.co.uk/about.html

AIS and a VHF radio ( those on the bridge are notorious for watching neither AIS or radar displays, but a call to their vessel gets their attention) might be a better way to go.

John
Blueberry

[JakeinDenver]

I'm intending to use both a VHF/AIS as well as the CARD. Figure the more I can see what's lurking the better...

thanks,

jake

[jfoster]

Hopefully, nobody sell them any more. They were a good idea back in the day. With continuous transmitting low power broadband radar signals being put out by the more modern radars.... not likely to work....

Come to think of it do active responders like SeeMe work when your vessel is swept with broadband radar? http://www.sea-me.co.uk/about.html

AIS and a VHF radio ( those on the bridge are notorious for watching neither AIS or radar displays, but a call to their vessel gets their attention) might be a better way to go.

John
Blueberry

Dear Mr Foster.

Thank you for your email.

I am afraid the current versions of Sea-me do not work with the broadband radar.

Best regards

Will
Munro Engineering Ltd

[jfoster]

The bottom line of the quote says it all. With the minimal power requirements and low price, what is not to like for the SHTP?

http://www.simrad-yachting.com/Products/Marine-Radars/Broadband-Radar/Broadband-Radar-Technology/


A TRULY DIFFERENT TECHNOLOGY
Traditional "pulse" radars use high-powered magnetrons to generate microwave signals with very short pulses of applied voltage. The first solid-state X-band radar technology has been developed, which utilizes FMCW techniques.

Simrad Broadband Radar™ sends a continuous transmission wave with linear increasing frequency (hence the term Broadband). The wave retains its frequency as it travels out and reflects back from any objects. Meanwhile, the transmitter continues to output an increasing frequency. The difference between the currently transmitted and received frequencies, coupled with the known rate of frequency increase, is the basis for precisely calculating a "time of flight" and target distance. Since FMCW constantly builds up radar return energy (vs. a single pulse), this system provides target detection superior to pulse radars while transmitting at far lower energy levels.

- The exclusive technology and performance characteristics of Broadband Radar™ make it an ideal match for almost any vessel.
- Unparalleled short-range resolution and discrimination; an ideal compliment to large radar systems on yachts.
- User-friendly operation makes it an ideal primary radar for small to medium-sized vessels.
- Small size, minimal power requirements, safer transmission energy levels; the advantages of sophisticated radar for all boats

[jfoster]

It looks like MER-VEILLE as well as C.A.R.D are unable to detect CW radar.

CW radar was in use on aircraft and in the military for years before it made its way into the marine market. Now that it has arrived, with a number of vendors now offering hat technology, the adoption may be quite swift.

It seems that having a CW radar on board may be a better solution than any of the radar detectors.

Things change. Try to cope. (grin)

John Foster
Blueberry, Nonsuch 22, sail # 48


Good morning,
The last upgrade of MER-VEILLE is only a best working of the acknoledge function.
We can't (today) detect continuous transmission broadband radar. We think power emitted is too low to detect classic radar and CW radar with the same device. These radars are also used for short range, and we are not sure it's a good way of research about a specific detector. In an other way AIS will become the major system in anticolision.
But your remarks are important for our thought.

Best regards
J.J.VIGNERON

[John Hayward]

Jake,

I have a CARD system on Dream Chaser. In the 2008 Transpac I ran it a lot and it never once went off even when large ships that the AIS picked up were visible. In the 2010 Transpac I turned it on several times when I picked up traffic on the radar or the AIS and still nothing. I have picked up signals in the harbor with it but I don't think it's worth the power consumption (low as it is) while singlehanding.

I used the AIS Radar 24/7 in 2010. It even makes a nifty night light. It draws almost no power and was my primary collision avoidance method. I also have a new Furuno radar with watchman mode (works for a minute every 10 or 20 minutes) sounds an alarm if a target has entered the zone you set. I used this closer to shore, in bad weather and when I was South of 28 degrees to alert me to squalls. It worked great too.

If I had to go with only one collision avoidance/traffic alerting system it would definitely be the AIS Radar. Great little gadget. My other AIS receiver requires that my laptop is on to work and the laptop is a huge power hog.

My thoughts, worth what you paid for them.

John
Dream Chaser
Valiant 40

[Chips'nSalsa]

I would love to do the shtp in 2012 and would like to start getting some budget numbers, where to get the qualifiers race schedule, and answers to the regular questions a first SHTP has. I am in Seattle and although I would love to sail it to SF and back from HI I can’t afford the time away from my job so I would have to get the boat shipped to SF and from HI back to Seattle.
Thanks
Astolfo

Astolfo / Adrian,

I'm planning for SHTP 2012 and also have time/work constraints - interested in Boat delivery options to Seattle - anything you've learned and can share would be appreciated.

Mark D.

[cafemontaigne]

Mark,

I didn't learn a whole lot. Shipping the boat back looked ridiculously expensive, and I don't have a trailer, so my options seemed limited to either selling it in HI, having someone sail it home for me, or sailing it home myself. Since the reason I got the boat was to sail it, I chose the latter.

Actually, I did learn two things. Firstly, the trip home was not nearly as unpleasant as I expected. In fact, it was a lot of fun, and a great sail. Secondly, there are a lot of kooks out there who would be happy to deliver a boat back to the mainland, with or without the owner. I'm sure this forum is infested with them. Whether you should trust them I will leave entirely up to you.

Adrian

[tpatel]

I too am interested in participating in the 2012 Shtp. I followed the 2010 Shtp as it was taking place and seem to spend most of my free time researching all aspects of the Shtp. My problem is that I am located in Tucson, AZ, and sail out of San Diego (mostly weekends and all of my vacations). I don't have any open ocean experience besides Catalina Island, Channel Islands and motorsailing up to Morro Bay last summer.

Friends have suggested that I crew on an ocean racing sailboat before attempting the Shtp, but I feel that it would be extremely difficult to find a position while I am in Tucson.

The positive things are that (1) I have a 4 year old boat (Jeanneau 36i) which I learned to sail on. I need a few big ticket items... SSB, extra asymmetric spinnaker, feathering prop, epirb, life raft, emergency tiller, and storm sail. (2) the Mrs has accepted the idea.

I want to thank everyone who has posted his experiences on this forum or on blogs. And I would love to hear any advice from Shtp veterans.

Tushar Patel

[Phil MacFarlane]

Tushar,

You need to be sailing your boat as much as possible. Single or double handed would be the best.

You need to sail your qualifier. The official SSS qualifier, the Long Pac starts June 6th You should be prepping your boat as if you were entering that race and then sail you own qualifier or join in with the Guadalupe Island Race down there.
I highly recommend one way or another you get very comfortable sailing your boat alone, single handed for a few days and nights. This will tell you if you like it or not. You should find this out sooner rather than later.

[BobJ]

Hi Tushar,

First correcting a typo - LongPac starts July 6th (a brief Phil-induced panic averted). You probably can't be ready for that so consider a late-season qualifier, known hereabouts as the "LatePac." I sailed mine in October (2005) and it was delightful. Otherwise yes, PSSA's Guadalupe Island Race is the ticket, although it could be a little late as a qualifier for the 2012 SHTP.

Your ocean time is about the same as mine was - but I had been sailing/racing inshore for many years. San Francisco Bay in the Summer is pretty good preparation for the rougher parts of a typical TransPac. If you aren't comfortable tucking in a reef solo with the boat crashing along on autopilot, and then going back to your tea and crumpets, you may not be ready yet.

But you're in the right place - welcome to the fold!

[Harrier]

Since when do you have to go on one of those organized excursions, such as LongPac or Guadalupe Race?

Just sail out from your home area the required distance and come home! At least that's the way it was when I qualified in 1984...shades of George Orwell!!!

[Phil MacFarlane]

Since when do you have to go on one of those organized excursions, such as LongPac or Guadalupe Race?

Just sail out from your home area the required distance and come home! At least that's the way it was when I qualified in 1984...shades of George Orwell!!!

Ken, I think you misread. We are telling him he DOES NOT have to do an official qualifier.
I am telling him to start sailing his boat single handed and start outfitting it.

I am in a similar place as Tushar. Although I have some experience I have a new boat that I have not sailed solo and does not meet the requirements. So what I'm telling Tushar, I am also telling my self. Get it done!

[ronnie simpson]

several of us are in the same boat. ie- have done the race, but have new boats that need to be prepared/ 400 mile qualified.

Adam and I are planning another "LatePac", such as we did last year. basically, a handful of guys will wait for a weather window and then head out at the same time, monitoring the same ssb frequencies. this will probably take place this fall or next spring. the more the merrier...

[Harrier]

OK, Phil
Of course your advice to him is the same as I or most anyone would give. Learn to sail your boat. Become comfortable offshore.
Some of the earlier comments pushing such as the Long Pac and Guadluope Race elicited my comment. This is called singlehanded sailing. I don't encourage buddy-boating to get prepped!

[Culebra]

I'll add my 2 cents. The first 4 days or so of the SHTP is the hard part. Very windy, seas on the beam, no sea legs (for softies like me), and you're really working hard to navigate, eat, sleep, sail the boat, and stay warm and dry. After that, everything gets relatively easy if you haven't broken something. So if you can do a LongPac or similar qualifier in windy conditions (don't pick your weather window) and afterward feel totally confident, then more than likely you're fine. But if you really want to be prepared, don't just do a qualifier or sail a ton of day sails with friends or even doublehanded. Do half-qualifiers solo, several times. Sail overnight solo from point to point, have a hot meal, pat yourself on the back, sail back again overnight, and pat yourself on the back again. You'll probably stay awake the whole time, and that's okay. Then do it again in lousy weather conditions. Then try staying alone on your boat for 5 or more days, on a coastal cruise, sailing both day and night, but not continuously, go ahead and anchor at times and have fun with it. Definitely try out a watch system--sleeping while sailing solo is eerie at first if you haven't done it before. Just don't do that in the shipping lanes! And have your AIS on. Get familiar with shipping, fishing vessels, etc. Get intimate with every part of your boat. Practice reefing, heaving to, change the headsail out of your furler in a seaway and hoist the small jib. That sort of thing. And have fun. If you aren't having fun, then that's a sign. If you're having fun, well, then you're hooked like the rest of us.

Paul/Culebra

[cafemontaigne]

That sounds like a pretty good training program. I had very little solo time on the boat before SHTP. About 2 days of an aborted qualifier, 5 days of the real thing, and a couple solo sails on Puget Sound and the lakes. I also had maybe 8 or 10 days of doublehanding, with one overnight trip. Next to that I had maybe 30 or 40 fully-crewed day sails.

The qualifiers revealed more about myself and the boat than anything else. I agree with Ken that there's something to be said about doing the qualifier on your own. Being on the Pacific alone felt like I was doing something very forbidden. There probably wasn't another sailboat on the ocean that day within a thousand miles (the Pacific Northwest coast in November isn't particularly pleasant), and the only people who knew where I was were most likely passed out drunk. Then I got the sh*t kicked out of me in the Strait of Juan de Fuca in what seemed like fairly benign conditions, stopped having fun, and promised myself I would never do the transpac. When it came time to head for Hanalei I was glad I'd had that experience, because I knew what the boat and I were capable of, and having other boats within 100 miles, radio check-ins and people on shore tracking me made it feel like a walk in the park.

That being said, LongPac (and LatePac) sound like a lot of fun...

If you don't have many opportunities to sail, do it solo, challenge yourself, do your qualifier early, and take lots of notes.

[Por Sailor]

Hey Guys: What is the official word on a Qualifier? I am planning to smash my way out into the big pond for a few days. Its not practical for me to get to California to do some single handed racing. For anyone interested I had my Hobie 33 shipped back to Oakland from Oahu by Matson cost $3200 and that included shipping the trailer to Oahu. It was super easy and the people were great to deal with.

[cafemontaigne]

John,

If the rules haven't changed, it's 400NM nonstop solo, under sail, going at least 100NM offshore. I started out of Pt. Townsend, sailed out the Strait about 120NM and back. Tried to keep a nice log and sent that and the GPS track to the RC. Should be a little easier to get offshore if you make Victoria your start. The hardest part is timing it for good wind. I had to beat through the Strait both ways... Unlike Swiftsure you can choose when to go. It took me a couple tries to get a good weather window in October/November...

Here's a little description of my qualifier (http://adrianjohnson.info/?p=8). It was way harder than the SHTP. The qualifier took me about 92 hours, and I basically went 110 hours without sleep. With a better weather window you could probably do it in 80 or so. If I were doing it again I would stage out of Pt. Angeles instead of Pt. Townsend, and just sail further out to get the 400NM.

[solosailor]

For anyone interested I had my Hobie 33 shipped back to Oakland from Oahu by Matson cost $3200 and that included shipping the trailer to Oahu.What year was that? Sounds very low.

[Por Sailor]

I shipped Por Favor back after the 2010 Pac cup. I can pull up the keel so I paid less than the fixed keel boats. You pay by cu ft volume. So I paid for a package 8'x8'x40' this included the trailer tongue and mast overhang. There were about 20 or so Pac Cup boats as well as at least one SHTP boat so maybe we got a deal. It will be the same for 2012 as the Pac Cup starts on the 15 July. Cheers John

[Por Sailor]

Hey Guys, I just finished my qualifier 453 nm and got m102nm off Leonard Island off Vancouver Island. Got to be the weirdest thing I've ever done. I managed to sleep and everything. I'll try to post my short story when I get it together. Had a crazy Kite run down Juan de Fuca strait in 25+ kn of breeze. Adrian I know you will appreciate that. Cheers Johnny

[BobJ]

Congrat's! That's a big item to be able to cross off the list.

[cafemontaigne]

Nice! I remember how weird it felt to be out there on my own, looking for an imaginary waypoint.

Glad to hear you had a good run back in. I bet that was fun. About a year ago I was drifting at the entrance to the Strait for 3 days waiting for the wind to pick up...

[ronnie simpson]

Por Sailor,

Congrats on finishing your qualifier. That is a huge accomplishment, and one that will definitely serve you well as you continue to prepare for the race. You and your Hobie are an awesome addition to the race.

Ronnie

[Por Sailor]

Now we have that out of the way, where is the best place to start looking for accomodation in Hanalei? Cheers John

[dawnstar]

Ahoy captains and mates. this is a most
interesting topic.

Please excuse me but I should introduce
myself as this is my first post.

i will soon join my 60 foot vintage
racing trimaran in the Caribbean
and am bound for the Far Eastso should this projext of
a transpac race developo
and schedule permitting
i may very well appreciate the company of a good race.

incidedntly,
if anyone has an atn topclimber for sale, e tell me

[ronnie simpson]

por sailor,

we found our accomodations last year on craigslist. there are a lot of seasonal/ rental properties in hanalei, so if you find a place that you like, it's often possible to e-mail the seller and ask them if they have availability for the time that you will be there.

this worked for a crappy rental car as well.

hope this helps

ronnie