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Thread: Leaderboard?

  1. #1
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    Default Leaderboard?

    A faster rated boat (Ventus) that is 40nm behind a slower rated boat (Kato) shouldn't show 13 hours ahead correct should it?

  2. #2
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    It's dynamic and current boat speed seems to affect the projection too much. VENTUS was showing over 12 knots in the prior snap shot.

    I'm still thinking it's Commodore Dave.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobJ View Post
    It's dynamic and current boat speed seems to affect the projection too much. VENTUS was showing over 12 knots in the prior snap shot.

    I'm still thinking it's Commodore Dave.
    Be advised that there is a flurry of activity behind the scenes and the crack team RC is cogitating about that issue as you type. Christine Weaver, Jonathan Gutoff and I arrived at Lihue yesterday within minutes of each other. They flew Hawaiian air and got a complimentary breakfast and rum drinks. I flew United and got very bad coffee and one cookie. I will post RC photos here because this is the SSS site, right? This site will remain long after Word Press gets sold to Tesla or Credite Dauphin Internationale.

    Wish you were here, Greg and Bob. Wish you were all here! This is fun!
    Last edited by Philpott; 07-12-2016 at 11:33 AM.

  4. #4
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    Good golly, Jackie! You made it (at last) and I wish you the very best of The Tree, the finishes and Hanlei.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mewes View Post
    Good golly, Jackie! You made it (at last) and I wish you the very best of The Tree, the finishes and Hanlei.
    Thanks, Lucie. Chris and I are going to go to the botanical gardens and snorkeling. We probably won't go snorkeling at the botanical gardens but I am open to all experiences Kauain so if that's what is done then I will try it. Also surfing.
    Last edited by Philpott; 07-12-2016 at 12:10 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philpott View Post
    Thanks, Lucie. Chris and I are going to go to the botanical gardens and snorkeling. We probably won't go snorkeling at the botanical gardens but I am open to all experiences Kauain so if that's what is done then I will try it. Also surfing.
    Let me know if you plan to go surfing and want to rent a board and lessons. There's a guy I met down there 4 years ago that sets up near one of the hotels. I can do some searching and figure out where, if you're interested. Have fun snorkeling, but you might want to time it for when the tide is coming in.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Philpott View Post
    Be advised that there is a flurry of activity behind the scenes and the crack team RC is cogitating about that issue as you type.
    I can't remember what I gave Yellow Brick in 2012 when they had it screwed up. Difference in ratings x .589 and then average speed over the last 24 hours. Something like that.

  8. #8
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    Jackie, Keep those reports coming. There's many of us that wish we were there, and/or were on our way, one way or another. Your reports fuel the dream.

    All the best, Tom P.

  9. #9
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    The Question: Following Kato which seems to be many nm ahead of Ventus, which is same yacht class, but Ventus is listed as first. *Why is that?

    The answerHEre is the issues:

    1.* There is noise in the speed data.
    2.* In essence timing is synchronized because the time to finish is based on the distance to the finish and then that time is added to the time on course.* So if two readings are 4 hours apart for X and Y, and Y was the latest entry, her distance to the island would be closer, that would be offset by her additional 4 hours on the course when the correction factor for rating is tossed into the calculation.** If we wanted this to be very non noisy we should have averaged more readings, but then you would still be wrong.* Boats that go stuck in the hole, for example, would look even worse than they do.

    The prediction algorithm is fun because it is like discussing who is the best pitcher ever in baseball.Hello James,

    The leader board compares the Corrected Projected Elapsed Time (CPET) of all boats in the race.*

    CPET =* ((DTF/ProjectedSpeed) + TimeOnCourse) -* Rating*CourseDistance***** all adjusted to hours in this case.

    The ProjectedSpeed is where the variability occurs. We have to select an algorithm to guess speed. If you average many readings of speed the results are less noisy, but a boat that might actually win will not show on the leader display as it might take many readings for their average speed to rise and project what might happen.* If readings are averaged over too few tracker data points the results bounce around a lot.* We choose a 12 hour average, or three readings.** Suppose boat X and Y are matched in rating. Suppose X is behind Y . The latest tracker update occurs for boat X 3 hours ahead of the Y, and X is suddenly blasting along at 10 knots, while Y is still mired in a hole after being run over by a squall.** Suddenly X's projected finish time looks golden, and Y's is still sitting at a relatively lower speed.* Now X pulls ahead, even though physically behind.* Added to this is that the tracker speed data in momentary.* Each reading, every four hours, is the instantaneous GPS reading, which is itself dubious for a single reading. That is a tracker limitation.

    In the early part of the race the CPET was in 1000's of* hours for the boats stuck near the Farallon's.* At other points I have seen momentary speed readings that have pushed vessels way into the lead.

    I hope that helps.* The race of course isn't scored until all the boats have crossed the finish line. The map projection is just a projection. Someday we could all discuss the merits of a variety of scoring algorithm's.** Something that looked out and judged the weather and had a factor for a skippers performance comes to mind.** The projections for finish time we are using at HQ are based on a gut call for each boats speed.* In two days we should see how this all worked out.

    Regards,

    Brian Boschma
    Last edited by Philpott; 07-13-2016 at 03:04 AM.

  10. #10
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    Here's a synopsis from Pinnacle, the company managing the tracker page:

    "the device updates are independent of each other, so one boat could report at 8:45 AM and the other boat could report at 10 AM. If a data report happens to be when one boat has a strong wind, that could weight the logic too much in one direction or another. These calculations are based on a single data point every 4 hours, so take it with a grain of salt. The horse-race aspect to the leaderboard is just some data processing we've added to the map. It's a formula based on the data received, and so I wouldn't consider any calculation as anything more than a rough approximation based on the limited and raw data."

    As Brian says above, "The race of course isn't scored until all the boats have crossed the finish line."

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