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Thread: Sss raid

  1. #91
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    I might have to buy a recent production boat that's self-rescuing and cobble together a rig for it. There's a Vanguard 15 down the street that could work.

    Here's a video of a Cape Dory 10: https://vimeo.com/225766000

    I spent many hours in that boat. It was heavy and kind of a tub, and it was NOT self-rescuing (ask me how I know this...)

    They also made a Cape Dory 14. It had a gunter rig too, was better-proportioned than the 10, and had large sealed tanks in the bow and stern.
    .
    Last edited by BobJ; 10-01-2019 at 01:34 PM.

  2. #92
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    As a person who has watched Bob pull cart after cart of stuff up and down E Dock, I think you all are just causing him grief when you encourage his predilections.

    Instead why not just invite him to join you on your boat up the Napa? He could leave Surprise! in Vallejo for a night or so, go "up river" to check out Jim and Mary's new place, then uber back. A third boat is a wild and crazy idea for an accountant.

  3. #93
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    Well this is awkward... I already have three boats. The other two are each less than 8' long (though not by much) and unsuitable for RAIDing.

    Have any of our readers righted a Vanguard 15? How hard is it?

  4. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobJ View Post
    Well this is awkward... I already have three boats. The other two are each less than 8' long (though not by much) and unsuitable for RAIDing.

    Have any of our readers righted a Vanguard 15? How hard is it?
    Oh boy, yeah! After I tested out of the Techs

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    at University of Wisconsin Madison they let me sail a 420, which is very similar to a Vanguard.

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    With supervision, of course. Capsizing was a given and I was a bit younger then.

    You do have to move fast. The question for you, Bob, is: Can you move fast enough?
    Last edited by Philpott; 10-01-2019 at 06:14 PM.

  5. #95
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    Probably not - I was a bit younger too, when I raced dinghies.

    I just watched a video of a Vanguard 15 in heavy air. That's not the right boat for solo meandering. I want to meander.

    So another question: Jim mentions "a few RAIDs per year." Would these be multiple day events (sleeping on the beach, etc.)?

  6. #96
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    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LyuqJP...pJ1I3xgJjmYUFQ

    My preference would be Russell Brown's PT Spear.

    The video shows various forms of simulated capsizes and recoveries of the PT Spear.
    Last edited by AntsUiga; 10-02-2019 at 02:25 PM. Reason: Clarification on video.

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobJ View Post
    Probably not - I was a bit younger too, when I raced dinghies.

    I just watched a video of a Vanguard 15 in heavy air. That's not the right boat for solo meandering. I want to meander.

    So another question: Jim mentions "a few RAIDs per year." Would these be multiple day events (sleeping on the beach, etc.)?
    I would sure love to see a late Spring and then an early Fall mini-RAID. Gut feeling is that three days is about maximum. More than that, and folks can't get the time off. Starting with an overnight makes a LOT of sense.

    I don't think the Vanguard 15 is the RAID-type boat of choice. There's nowhere to put "stuff". When I was thinking hard about taking the skerry to do the Texas 200, which would last about 5 days, I worked out how I'd take all the "stuff"...which included a cheap camping tent, sleeping bag, sleeping pad, food and cooking gear. I figured I could get it all into about 4 dry bags and I also bought three of these.

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    which snap on, and then the inner lid twists on/off. It turns a 3.5 or 5 gallon bucket into a totally watertight, but easily accessible storage unit.
    Last edited by AlanH; 10-02-2019 at 12:02 PM.
    S-2 7.9: "Wildcat of Loch Awe"
    1968 Selmer Series 9 B-flat and A clarinets
    1962Buesher "Aristocrat" tenor saxophone
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  8. #98
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    A Lido 14 would work for a camping RAID-type boat. So would an O'Day daysailer. An O-Day javelin...in fact, really any 14-16 foot small boat with flotation tanks / seats, but enough room to store "stuff" would work. I had my eyes on an AMF Sunbird a long time ago for exactly this purpose. The cabin on a Sunbird is really for "stuff" but if desperate, and with a boom cover over the front half of the cockpit you COULD sleep in it.

    A totally dedicated race boot, like with rolled-over seating, like a 420, not so much.

    A thistle with a cut-down mainsail...maybe 3-4 feet off the mast and 2 feet off the boom, might work.
    S-2 7.9: "Wildcat of Loch Awe"
    1968 Selmer Series 9 B-flat and A clarinets
    1962Buesher "Aristocrat" tenor saxophone
    Piper One Design 24, Hull #35; "Alpha"

  9. #99
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    Ants, I have the same problem with this capsize video as I have with the SAS "jump off the dock/into the pool" exercise. Of testing the emergency rudder on SF Bay. None of them offers what is likely to be real. You probably capsized due to wind and/or waves. Getting the boat turned around, getting in upright, and getting back in will be much more difficult than the example. In a small boat you're likely floating in your lifejacket because 1) you fell overboard due to winds and waves or 2) your boat sank. Unless your lifejacket has leg straps you'll struggle to keep it down and you'll struggle to keep waves from breaking into your face. Don't get me wrong, I think practice is a necessary, and I have practice jumped into pools or next to the dock several times to test floatation & clambering back onboard and I have recovered from many capsizings in small boats on lakes. I don't know about San Pablo Bay on a day with teenish winds and that short ebb chop? Or worse? At nearly 80, I don't think I have the physical capacity for any of the above on even semi-open water like San Pablo Bay, so these are the thoughts of an outsider for the RAID.

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wylieguy View Post
    Ants, I have the same problem with this capsize video as I have with the SAS "jump off the dock/into the pool" exercise. Of testing the emergency rudder on SF Bay. None of them offers what is likely to be real. You probably capsized due to wind and/or waves. Getting the boat turned around, getting in upright, and getting back in will be much more difficult than the example. In a small boat you're likely floating in your lifejacket because 1) you fell overboard due to winds and waves or 2) your boat sank. Unless your lifejacket has leg straps you'll struggle to keep it down and you'll struggle to keep waves from breaking into your face. Don't get me wrong, I think practice is a necessary, and I have practice jumped into pools or next to the dock several times to test floatation & clambering back onboard and I have recovered from many capsizings in small boats on lakes. I don't know about San Pablo Bay on a day with teenish winds and that short ebb chop? Or worse? At nearly 80, I don't think I have the physical capacity for any of the above on even semi-open water like San Pablo Bay, so these are the thoughts of an outsider for the RAID.

    Those are excellent points. Also, watching Russell Brown get back into his dinghy is much easier than me getting back into any dinghy.

    Some items that were noteworthy to me. When the mast was on the water, the limited amount of boat submerged in the water. There is plenty of flotation to keep an excess amount of water from entering. I capsized a Lightning (with all flotation under the deck) in Monterey Bay. When the Lightning was upright again, there was no way I could sail away due to flotation placement.

    Also, I am not sure where Russell found water that was relatively warm in Port Townsend area. Most of the deeper water is colder than SF Bay.

    As for choppy conditions in San Pablo Bay in a RAID vessel, I have identified my bail out points if conditions begin to deteriorate. My sabot dinghies stay home for a San Pablo Bay event.

    The sail rig is optional, so it someone wanted to use a different sail plan, that could be easily accommodated.

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