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Thread: Hedgehog

  1. #11
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    Why? Why? I didn't see anything alarming on that blog. They are racing just like everyone else. The way I read it, they would have like to give the J105 more room, but the 105 didn't call for it, and they themselves didn't have room to tack away unless forced by the boat calling for sea room...

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanH View Post
    That, right there, seems to be powerful incentive to me to just disallow SSS races from being used for season-counters in OD classes. If a Class wants to have a couple of shorthanded races, they can put 'em on, themselves.

    Or, possibly the SSS could decide to still accept the entry fees, but any OD class that has an SSS race as a season counter in the Class, races on a different course from the rest of the fleet.

  2. #12
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    It was this that bothered me so much....

    "It was a ‘local distance race’ counter for the new class scoring format, so it drew out those vying for every high score then can get their hands on ..."

    There's something about how that's worded that just really bothers me....that people are more concerned about their season high score than being safe. I know, they didn't SAY that....but it FEELS like that, to me.

    That, and that they flat-out said that they were involved in a situation that almost put a J-105 on the rocks. At least they were upfront about that being really upsetting, but they also were relieved that the J-105 "was gracious" and didn't call for sea room. --- We pinned a J105 in against the shore because we had no room to tack either. They were gracious and never called for sea room. Minutes later I see a boat on the rocks in that same spot - apparently an Olson 29 - so glad it wasn’t that J105, but still feeling gutwrenched.

    I have to wonder who pinned THEM into the situation where they couldn't tack away to free up sea room for that un-named J-105.

    I've made mistakes out there, too, but none that ever threaten to put another sailors boat on the rocks.
    S-2 7.9: "Wildcat of Loch Awe"
    1968 Selmer Series 9 B-flat and A clarinets
    1962Buesher "Aristocrat" tenor saxophone
    Piper One Design 24, Hull #35; "Alpha"

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travieso View Post
    Why? Why? I didn't see anything alarming on that blog. They are racing just like everyone else. The way I read it, they would have like to give the J105 more room, but the 105 didn't call for it, and they themselves didn't have room to tack away unless forced by the boat calling for sea room...
    Bold added by me....

    Dan, I would hope that sailors who participate in our events have the foresight to see a dangerous situation developing, irregardless of "racing rules" and take steps to avoid them. To my mind, that the J-105 didn't call for room is NOT a reason for the guys on the Moore 24 to not tack away. Getting pinned there by another boat, probably is a good reason, but then the onus of seeing a bad situation developing lies with that un-named boat.

    The "Racing Rules" and the "Protest Committee" might not agree with me. I just, personally don't ever, ever want to be the cause of something like this happening. It's a sailboat race. It's a rinky-tink little sailboat race on San Francisco Bay and nobody but about 100 of us who are intimately involved with it, give a rip about who won or who lost. Is winning that race, even "By The Rules" so important that I should take a risk of running someone's boat up on the rocks?

    I say....no.

    Other people might say..."Section 15.4.1 of the US Sailing Racing Rules dictate......"

    Everybody has different levels of risk tolerance....yeah, I get that.
    Last edited by AlanH; 03-12-2020 at 06:01 PM.
    S-2 7.9: "Wildcat of Loch Awe"
    1968 Selmer Series 9 B-flat and A clarinets
    1962Buesher "Aristocrat" tenor saxophone
    Piper One Design 24, Hull #35; "Alpha"

  4. #14
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    Sep 2007
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    I don't have a big disagreement here, but the rules are there to make racing possible. If we don't follow the rules and use protests to enforce them, it would be chaos out there. You can certainly make the case for more room when shorthanded both on the water and int the protest room....

    Quote Originally Posted by AlanH View Post
    Bold added by me....

    Dan, I would hope that sailors who participate in our events have the foresight to see a dangerous situation developing, irregardless of "racing rules" and take steps to avoid them. To my mind, that the J-105 didn't call for room is NOT a reason for the guys on the Moore 24 to not tack away. Getting pinned there by another boat, probably is a good reason, but then the onus of seeing a bad situation developing lies with that un-named boat.

    The "Racing Rules" and the "Protest Committee" might not agree with me. I just, personally don't ever, ever want to be the cause of something like this happening. It's a sailboat race. It's a rinky-tink little sailboat race on San Francisco Bay and nobody but about 100 of us who are intimately involved with it, give a rip about who won or who lost. Is winning that race, even "By The Rules" so important that I should take a risk of running someone's boat up on the rocks?

    I say....no.

    Other people might say..."Section 15.4.1 of the US Sailing Racing Rules dictate......"

    Everybody has different levels of risk tolerance....yeah, I get that.

  5. #15
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    " If we don't follow the rules and use protests to enforce them, it would be chaos out there. "

    Two thumbs up to that.
    Maybe I should have protested the boat that went inside the Pt. Blunt buoy.
    S-2 7.9: "Wildcat of Loch Awe"
    1968 Selmer Series 9 B-flat and A clarinets
    1962Buesher "Aristocrat" tenor saxophone
    Piper One Design 24, Hull #35; "Alpha"

  6. #16
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    Dec 2012
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    Alameda CA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travieso View Post
    I don't have a big disagreement here, but the rules are there to make racing possible. If we don't follow the rules and use protests to enforce them, it would be chaos out there. You can certainly make the case for more room when shorthanded both on the water and int the protest room....
    100% in agreement to that.
    for consideration; it's also possible for the OA to modify the rules to enshrine allowances and exceptions in the SI's, though the language and how to identify short/single handed boats on the course can be very sticky... way way way back, when the SSS was first allowed to sail in YRA races (1979) there was a provision that the Singlehanded boats be required to fly a #1 (japan) flag from their back-stay, in order for others to know to keep clear. I know this from the archived letter from YRA to George Sigler that Kimball sent me some years back.

    To the broader point, believe me, if I could positively ID the other boat, I would protest. Loudly. The sad reality is I can't and no one is stepping up to own it.
    DH

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaveH View Post
    To the broader point, believe me, if I could positively ID the other boat, I would protest. Loudly. The sad reality is I can't and no one is stepping up to own it.
    DH
    That really sucks. That is the part that bugs me the most, is how some folks just don't take responsibility. Even after winning protests and appeals after I was rammed by another competitor a few years back, that never took ownership or offer to help cover the cost of the damages. So rules don't fix all and our love for shorthanded sailing doesn't automatically filter assholes.... But at least I could identify mine...

  8. #18
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    Dec 2012
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    Default Hedgeheog is back!!!

    Like the add says, "like it never even happened";
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    OK - Well yeah, it most certainly happened.
    But - we are back! - Rufus completed everything to his amazingly high standards a week ago.
    Stepped the mast and re-rigged with Glenn and Jesse this past Wednesday.
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    I'll deliver sails and other locker based necessities this weekend, then go for a sail.
    yes, by myself.
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  9. #19
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    Aug 2009
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    Sausalito CA
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    Wow! Nice work! See you out there Hedgehog!

  10. #20
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    Sep 2007
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    You certainly went to extremes to put the rest of us on hold while you got it repaired.

    Congratulations!

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